15-Dec-91 11:00:00 Sb: Hello Fm: MENSA To: All Greetings, I'm not sure if I belong here since I'm not a member of the Mensa Society. However, since this is a CIS forum and since monetary returns to both CIS and to the SYSOPs is dependent on participation, I assume I'll be welcome. I do enjoy discussions with smart people, but I have a little trouble with anyone who tries to decide who is smart. I think my percentile score on the ACT test a number of years ago was 99.9 or something like that but I was never sure what that meant and I never knew my IQ, if any. I have lived long enough to convince both me and others that I'm pretty dumb in a number of ways. Anyway, I'm uploading a few files named, Philom, Burglar, and CJMag. I hope someone will take a look at them and comment either on their content or on the evidence they provide as to my degree of smartness, (dumbness?). With anticipation, Duane S3 #: 1167 S3/Hospitality Suite 15-Dec-91 20:55:57 Sb: #1097-Hello Fm: Bob Juch [Mensa] 72701,2233 To: Duane Bristow 72711,1414 Thanks for the files. "Dumb in a number of ways"? I think you've found your peers. #: 1169 S3/Hospitality Suite 15-Dec-91 21:11:38 Sb: #1097-Hello Fm: Frank Demarest 76116,2065 To: Duane Bristow 72711,1414 Being "pretty dumb in a number of ways" is not unusual among Mensans, often nicknamed Densans. You might consider digging up your old scores and joining. Frank. #: 1280 S3/Hospitality Suite 16-Dec-91 19:50:22 Sb: #1097-Hello Fm: Bill Fleet [Mensa] 72406,2512 To: Duane Bristow 72711,1414 Hi Duane, You're always welcome here. This is everyone's living room, and there's beer in the fridge. Just don't get jam on the carpet, that's all we ask. It's new. Where do you hail from, and what do you do? Bill F ÿ #: 813971 S0/Outbox File 16-Dec-91 22:11:00 Sb: Hello Fm: MENSA REP 1280 To: Bill Fleet [Mensa] 72406,2512 Bill, Thanks for the welcome. I'll take my shoes off and put my feet up. I'm a professional Forester by education (univ. of GA, '68), farmer, and for the last 13 years a computer consultant. I live in a rural area of South Central Kentucky, Albany. Wife, Eva, 2 boys 14 and 21. I'm a middle aged handsome cuss according to the missus. Lately I've tended toward armchair philosophy but it don't pay much. I guess I'll have to get back to business programming which do pay better. Whut about yerself? Duane #: 1404 S3/Hospitality Suite 17-Dec-91 13:10:02 Sb: #1324-#Hello Fm: Bill Fleet [Mensa] 72406,2512 To: Duane Bristow 72711,1414 Well, I'm a graphic designer by trade and training (BFA, Univ. of Bridgport, '82), but I seem to be turning into a Desktop Publisher/ Computer Consultant/ Digital Prepress kinda guy/ Gofer-Guru. Gosh, I do love those computers, though. I flirt with doing armchair philosphy, but I'm really hoping to be a couch potato when I grow up. Cable TV, the works. Do you still do Forestry, and what's it like? Bill F #: 815239 S0/Outbox File 17-Dec-91 19:19:00 Sb: Hello Fm: MENSA REP 1404 To: Bill Fleet [Mensa] 72406,2512 Bill, That's an open ended question. Yes I still work in forestry occasionally as a consultant but I have found as I have gotten older that computer consulting is physically easier and pays more so I don't do a lot of forestry work. Forestry is applied biology, the science of maximizing benefits from forested lands, be they timber, wildlife, forage, watershed, recreational, aesthetic or other values. It involves a lot of outdoor work, science, math, and personnel management. It can also involve engineering, economics, public relations and a host of other things. I worked 11 years as a forester for the state of Kentucky. I assisted landowners in managing forests on privately owned woodlands and worked on state owned forests. I was an assistant district forester supervising forest fire control and forest management activites in a ten county area of SE KY which contained around two million acres of woodland. We had about 30 full time employees and sometimes had as many as 200 employees during rough fire seasons. I usually enjoyed the work but sometimes put in very long hours and sometimes the weather, terrain, or people involved were not ideal. I am long winded and had better stop here. I sometimes end up writing books when I get an open ended question. Duane #: 1461 S3/Hospitality Suite 18-Dec-91 03:10:41 Sb: #1425-#Hello Fm: Bob Juch [SL] 72701,2233 To: Duane Bristow 72711,1414 You should see what they're doing with computers at the Boise Interagency Fire Center (BIFC). I also bet Boise Cascade does a lot of computational forestry. #: 1507 S3/Hospitality Suite 18-Dec-91 19:17:16 Sb: #1425-Hello Fm: Bill Fleet [Mensa] 72406,2512 To: Duane Bristow 72711,1414 No, this is fascinating. It's a whole area I know nothing about. Except that it's one of those fields that TV makes poor use of in sitcoms and soap operas. You know, where so-and-so has a nervous breakdown and becomes a forest ranger to get away from it all. That's obviously not true, from what you say. Bill F ÿ #: 816722 S0/Outbox File 18-Dec-91 20:02:00 Sb: Hello Fm: MENSA REP 1461 To: Bob Juch [SL] 72701,2233 Bob, I have a pretty good idea of some of the things they are doing at Boise in general although I have no detailed knowledge. As a forester and a computer programmer I can see all kinds of applications both in fire control and industry. I am curious. Do you live there? Do you work in or around the timber industry? In 1978 I presented a proposal to the Director of the Kentucky Division of Forestry, an older gentleman about to retire, at a State Forestry Meeting. The gist of my proposal was that I could computerize the bookkeeping in the 9 District Forestry offices in the state as well as fire control statistics and that computerized reports could be relayed by floppy disk to a computer at the state office for an equipment investment of $25,000 to $30,000. I, of course, pointed out a number of benefits of doing this. His comment was that for $25,000 he could buy half a fireplow and he was sure that would be more useful than ten computers. FYI a fireplow is a small bulldozer with a very heavy duty plow mounted on it. It is used to plow a firebreak around a forest fire. I left the Division of Forestry the next year, but not because of that incident. Duane #: 816740 S0/Outbox File 18-Dec-91 20:20:00 Sb: Hello Fm: MENSA REP 1507 To: Bill Fleet [Mensa] 72406,2512 Bill, If you will understand that day to day forestry work is generally routine with quite a bit of paperwork, meetings, and maybe two to four days a week spent in the woods, I will tell a few stories that make it interesting to me. Just remember that its not like that all the time. I went into forestry because my high school french teacher had a nervous breakdown. That's another story I'll tell sometime if anyone is interested. When I went into the field I had watched a lot of Lassie on TV and I figured foresters spent a lot of time in fire towers with occasional time out to rescue beautiful damsels who had managed to get into distress in the woods. If they got into distress somewhere else I figured Knights on horseback would rescue them. Anyway, I worked in forestry full time for eleven years and part time for another eleven or so years and the only people I ever got to save the life of were a few hardened criminals. They sure weren't beautiful damsels. Actually it was probably for the best though because my wife never did care much for the idea of my rescuing any kind of damsels. The most exciting work I did in forestry was in fire control. Most of the day to day fire control work is done by non-professional. The only time us professional foresters got involved in it was when the fire season got so bad that everything was out of control. So after I got a few seasons under my belt and my boss decided that I was probably one of the best fire strategists in the state .... Therefore I usually got involved in the biggest fires or the most important or those that were giving the most trouble. Once during a very bad season our fire control man in our hottest county got sick. The boss told me to handle that county until it rained and he and the rest of the guys would try to handle the other 9 counties in the district. I left the office about 8:30 that morning and by 2:00 the next morning I was bringing my crew off my 12th forest fire of the day. They ranged in size from 1 acre to 100 acres. Another time in that same county I finally got a fire under control that we had been fighting for ten days. Just as my crew came off the fire it began to rain, so we never got credit for controlling it. When I did the paperwork later and mapped the fire I realized that it had burned around 7,500 acres. Thats nearly 12 square miles. Later the state office got a call from NASA. They were picking up a big black area on satellite photos that hadn't been there a few days before. The only thing they could think of was a forest fire but they had never picked up one that big in Kentucky before. I think it was probably around 500 acres on the official paperwork because the state office didn't like fires to get too big officially. Anyway enough for now. Duane S3 #: 1541 S3/Hospitality Suite 18-Dec-91 22:42:10 Sb: #1532-Hello Fm: Bob Beatty 70004,1073 To: Duane Bristow 72711,1414 Interesting story about your Forester. No, I didn't live there, but I did work for the paper and plywood industry at Champion International, headquartered in Hamilton, Ohio. I was the Corporate Financial Systems Consultant, and we were designing a commodities system of our own. To help us design it, we visited four firms that already had one - Boise Cascade, Weyerhauser, Crown Zellerbach, and Potlatch. #: 1558 S3/Hospitality Suite 19-Dec-91 01:24:41 Sb: #1532-Hello Fm: Bob Juch [SL] 72701,2233 To: Duane Bristow 72711,1414 Yes, I live in Boise. One of my friends-who-should-join-Mensa made the front page of several computer newspapers for his development of a LAN composed of laptops linked to BIFC by a satellite. One of my Mensa friends repairs radios for BIFC. Many of the radios are programmed by connecting them to a PC. I therefore keep up with what is being done by the Forest Service. #: 1559 S3/Hospitality Suite 19-Dec-91 01:29:15 Sb: #1534-Hello Fm: Bob Juch [SL] 72701,2233 To: Duane Bristow 72711,1414 Funny, but the only fire watchers I've met around here _are_ beautiful damsels who rescue errant knights. #: 1566 S3/Hospitality Suite 19-Dec-91 01:55:43 Sb: #1533-Hello Fm: Mike Steiner 70363,2220 To: Duane Bristow 72711,1414 >>> I went into forestry because my high school french teacher had a nervous breakdown. That's another story I'll tell sometime if anyone is interested. <<< Now, *that* is a line that we just can't pass up. Please elucidate. #: 1659 S3/Hospitality Suite 19-Dec-91 16:31:15 Sb: #1534-Hello Fm: Charlie Stine 70662,2115 To: Duane Bristow 72711,1414 Duane, perhaps you can answer a question that just popped up. In a movie with Richard Dreyfuss he was a pilot who dropped something on fires. What was he dropping? Charlie ÿ #: 818249 S0/Outbox File 19-Dec-91 21:29:00 Sb: Hello Fm: MENSA REP 1559 To: Bob Juch [SL] 72701,2233 Bob, I did hire a female fire crew leader one time. She wasn't beautiful but she was good looking. It would be a misnomer to call her a damsel because the term just doesn't fit a woman who can lead a crew of fire fighters through the mountains day and night. She was excellent though at recruiting fire fighters off the streets. As I remember she worked for us through three or four fire seasons. Duane S3 #: 818258 S0/Outbox File 19-Dec-91 21:38:00 Sb: Hello Fm: MENSA REP 1566 To: Mike Steiner 70363,2220 Mike, I went to high school in a small town in a very rural area of the state. Two weeks after I enrolled in first year French the spinster lady who taught it had a nervous breakdown or something. Anyway the school system was left with no one who could speak French. They put an English teacher in charge of the French department. She had never spoken or probably heard a word of French in her life. I took two years of high school French under her. I got A's. After all je parle francais plus de elle. (or something). When I got to the University of Kentucky they looked over my ACT scores and my High school transcript and enrolled me in several advanced classes including 2nd year college French. I said fine. I walked into my French class and the pretty young French woman teaching the class said in English, "From now on we all speak French" and they did. Those were the last words I understood in that class all day. As soon as I got out of class I went to my faculty advisor and said, "I can't take this French." He said, "You're in the college of Arts and Sciences and to graduate you have to have two years of foreign language. Because of your high school background, they're going to require you to take French." I said, "OK, what colleges do you have that don't require foreign languages?" He said, "Agriculture and Forestry." My father had never completed High School and had worked hard on a farm for fifteen years with very little to show for it. He was determined that I go to college. He knew I loved the farm and the outdoors, so one of the last things he told me before I left for Lexington was, "Son, decide what you want to major in. Anything you decide on is fine so long as you stay out of farming." So when this guy told me that my choices were Forestry and Agriculture or learn to speak French, I decided that I had always wanted to be a Forester. Four years later I got a sheepskin from the University of Georgia and was a sure nuf forester. Duane S3 #: 818276 S0/Outbox File 19-Dec-91 21:56:00 Sb: Hello Fm: MENSA REP 1659 To: Charlie Stine 70662,2115 Charlie, He was dropping what we always called slurry. Its water with a chemical added that makes it thick and sticky so that it sticks to everything it touches. Also makes it a little slower to evaporate. The movie was "Always" I think. Contrary to popular movies, etc. slurry does not put out a fire, only cools it down so that a fire crew on the ground can get close enough to get the fire under control. I was a fire boss on a fire once on the South side of Pine Mountain just above the city of Pineville Kentucky. The district dispatcher radioed me to say that a Forest Service plane that was supposed to dump a load of slurry on a National Forest Fire in Virginia had gotten lost or had lost his fire or something. Now those B29's can take off with a load of slurry but they tell me they can't land with it. So it had been decided that I could have him so he would have someplace to dump his load. It was real interesting trying to guide a huge bomber in to the place at the head of the fire where my crew was located when my radio would only talk to the state dispatcher. He had a radio to talk to the U.S. dispatcher who could talk to the bomber. Now the trick is keep your crew as close as you can to the fire but now close enough that they get knocked down by the slurry. You also have to guide the pilot in the bomber so that he drops his load close enough to your crew that you can hit the fire before the slurry evaporates. The pilot can see the fire but he can't see your men. If he drops too far away from the crew the slurry will evaporate and the fire will be raging again before the crew can get to it. Also, its mighty impressive when that big bomber finally makes his drop run. He comes in right on the tree tops and when he drops the fire suddenly seems to almost go out. Of course you have to realize that thats only temporary and if you don't stop the fire right then it will be out of control again. Anyway, another long answer to a short question. Duane S3 #: 1797 S3/Hospitality Suite 20-Dec-91 00:44:17 Sb: #1782-Hello Fm: S Patrick Gallaty 70444,132 To: Duane Bristow 72711,1414 Foolishly, that appeals to me. Firefighting in the brush around the clock. I must be nuts. #: 1804 S3/Hospitality Suite 20-Dec-91 01:08:08 Sb: #1787-Hello Fm: Bob Juch [SL] 72701,2233 To: Duane Bristow 72711,1414 My BIFC friends tell me that the scene in "Always" where the guy on the hilltop observing the slurry drops gets it dumped on him would actually have killed him. True or not? #: 1825 S3/Hospitality Suite 20-Dec-91 03:54:39 Sb: #1785-Hello Fm: Mike Steiner 70363,2220 To: Duane Bristow 72711,1414 Yup, that surely was a story all right. Thanks for telling it. #: 1865 S3/Hospitality Suite 20-Dec-91 11:05:23 Sb: #1785-Hello Fm: Charlie Stine 70662,2115 To: Duane Bristow 72711,1414 Duane, that was a great story. I personally hated the French I took in high school. Later Charlie #: 1878 S3/Hospitality Suite 20-Dec-91 11:05:59 Sb: #1787-Hello Fm: Charlie Stine 70662,2115 To: Duane Bristow 72711,1414 The picture of a B29 "dropping a load" is certaintly picturesque! Anyway, thanks for the explanation. Charlie ÿ #: 819516 S0/Outbox File 20-Dec-91 18:36:00 Sb: Hello Fm: MENSA REP 1797 To: S Patrick Gallaty 70444,132 Patrick, Yep, you are nuts but so is every firefighter I've ever met. In spite of the stories we tell about our love for the environment, etc. the real reason people fight fires is because it's a hell of a sport. Done right, its a team sport pitting the physical endurance and training (if any) of the crew along with the tactical and strategic intelligence of the fire boss against the forces of nature. Sometimes its just a long night of raking fire line and stopping to rest and talk with the crew and hoping somebody comes up the mountain sometime to bring you some food. Sometimes its fast furious work at the head of a fire with the wind trying to leapfrog the fire behind you and you hoping for a little luck to let you hold the fire. Sometimes its watching the mountain explode in smoke and flames in a hollow below you and getting the hell out of there as fast as possible. Sometimes its being so thirsty you'll drink from a mudhole and try to strain the mud out with your teeth. Sometimes its watching the flames go out the top of 70 foot high pines and knowing you'll have to wait for dusk to even be able to approach the fire. And sometimes its watching the dances of fire devils following one another in rows up a mountainside. That's my attempt at making a usually dirty job seem romantic. How ya'll like it. Duane S3 #: 819525 S0/Outbox File 20-Dec-91 18:45:00 Sb: Hello Fm: MENSA REP 1804 To: Bob Juch [SL] 72701,2233 Bob, Would the slurry kill the men? It depends. There is certainly enough weight there. If I remember right they told me the one that dropped on my fire dropped 8000 gallons. At 8 pounds per gallon thats beaucoup tons. On the other hand the bomber is supposed to start dropping high enough that the wind spreads the stuff over as much area as possible and if its done that way there's very little weight per square foot. I knew a crew that got dumped on once. It didn't hurt anyone, just made them uncomfortable. Course they were a state crew helping out on a federal fire and I guess no one took the trouble to tell the pilot where the state guys were. The only time us state guys got a bomber was when the feds ordered one and then couldn't use it. They were much too expensive to be used on state fires. Duane S3 #: 819526 S0/Outbox File 20-Dec-91 18:46:00 Sb: Hello Fm: MENSA REP 1825 To: Mike Steiner 70363,2220 I really enjoyed it. I haven't had a chance to tell these old war stories in years. Duane S3 #: 1987 S3/Hospitality Suite 20-Dec-91 21:32:40 Sb: #1975-Hello Fm: S Patrick Gallaty 70444,132 To: Duane Bristow 72711,1414 Great! How do I join? ÿ #: 820376 S0/Outbox File 21-Dec-91 8:56:00 Sb: Hello Fm: MENSA REP 1987 To: S Patrick Gallaty 70444,132 Patrick, Just appear at any State Forestry office or U. S. Forest service office around the beginning of fire season in that area and say "Here's fresh meat." Duane S3 #: 2123 S3/Hospitality Suite 21-Dec-91 12:33:49 Sb: #2099-Hello Fm: S Patrick Gallaty 70444,132 To: Duane Bristow 72711,1414 Yipes! That conjures up some very unpleasant images. ÿ #: 2157 S3/Hospitality Suite 21-Dec-91 18:31:11 Sb: #1533-Hello Fm: Bill Murdock 71260,3375 To: Duane Bristow 72711,1414 Duane, >>I went into forestry because my high school french teacher had a nervous breakdown.<< Um. That was good for a case of whiplash. Are you supporting the previous statement about soap operas or is there more here than caught the eye as the head hit the back rest? Bill #: 2159 S3/Hospitality Suite 21-Dec-91 18:54:42 Sb: #1534-Hello Fm: Marci McKim 73577,2250 To: Duane Bristow 72711,1414 Duane: I've enjoyed your posts about forestry. According to the aptitude test I took in high school, I was destined to be a forest ranger . I missed my calling, but have always been curious as to what it is I've missed. Marci #: 2160 S3/Hospitality Suite 21-Dec-91 18:54:46 Sb: #1785-Hello Fm: Marci McKim 73577,2250 To: Duane Bristow 72711,1414 LOL! Life sure is funny! ÿ #: 821828 S0/Outbox File 22-Dec-91 9:08:00 Sb: Hello Fm: MENSA REP 2157 To: Bill Murdock 71260,3375 Bill, Yes, I'm supporting the statement about soap opera and TV depictions of forestry being at least somewhat shallow. However, there is actually less here than caught the eye as far as the statement about nervous breakdowns. To tell the truth I had made no connection whatsoever between Bill Fleet's statement: and my statement: I did not even realize that we had both used the same phrase, nervous breakdown, in our messages until you pointed it out. I wish I were deep enough to have planned use of language that way, but I'm much more shallow than I sometimes seem. Duane S3 #: 821903 S0/Outbox File 22-Dec-91 10:23:00 Sb: Hello Fm: MENSA REP 2159 To: Marci McKim 73577,2250 Marci, When you missed your calling to go into forestry what did you go into instead? Is it something similiar or was the aptitude test way off in left field? Are you now sorry or glad you didn't go into forestry? BTW, a forester is a professional with a degree in forestry, usually forest management, but it could be some other field of forestry. The popular term forest ranger or park ranger has no specific meaning but usually refers to someone who works for a state or federal forest or park organization, wears some type of a uniform and is usually seen quite a bit by the public. At least 95% of the people usually referred to as rangers are not foresters. Duane S3 #: 2483 S3/Hospitality Suite 23-Dec-91 20:37:39 Sb: #2227-Hello Fm: Marci McKim 73577,2250 To: Duane Bristow 72711,1414 Duane: I don't know how far off the test was, because I would probably enjoy forestry, but I turned out to be a technical writer. To the general public, "forest ranger" covers a multitude of professions, I realize . It conjures up pictures of working side-by-side with Smokey the Bear, which, of course, ties in with the romantic image you've alluded to. Marci ÿ #: 823897 S0/Outbox File 23-Dec-91 19:37:00 Sb: Hello Fm: MENSA REP 2483 To: Marci McKim 73577,2250 Marci, Technical writer, eh? Does that mean you write equipment manuals and that type of thing, or columnist for technical magazines, or something else that I don't know about? I did work quite a bit with Smokey, now that you mention it. I resurrected the Junior Forest Ranger program for 4th and 5th grade students in our forestry district and took Smokey to quite a few parades. Duane #: 2855 S3/Hospitality Suite 25-Dec-91 18:36:54 Sb: #2226-Hello Fm: Bill Murdock 71260,3375 To: Duane Bristow 72711,1414 Duane, <> Bark deep, I presume. :>) Bill #: 2859 S3/Hospitality Suite 25-Dec-91 20:12:40 Sb: #2491-Hello Fm: Marci McKim 73577,2250 To: Duane Bristow 72711,1414 Duane: I specialize in software documentation, from functional spec through online Help facilities. It's fun, I get new toys to play with all the time . I occasionally write for technical publications, and about once a year I get stirred up enough to write an opinion piece that somebody will buy. It's great that you resurrected the Junior Forest Ranger program! If you get the kids interested in maintaining the forest, they're a lot less trouble when they grow up. Marci #: 3504 S9/Mind To Mind 29-Dec-91 03:20:21 Sb: #3492-Did I do something Dumb? Fm: Mike Steiner 70363,2220 To: joanna cohen 73167,243 That is very true, Marci. One of the reasons I wrote that message was because of the discussion on charity that had already been started, and in the hopes of spurring a discussion about private vs. public charity. #: 832215 S0/Outbox File 29-Dec-91 14:15:00 Sb: Something dumb? Fm: MENSA To: All A couple of message threads including the words something dumb reminded me of the time I sent for a brochure I wanted. The ad said to send a stamped self-addressed envelope, which I forgot to do. In a couple of weeks I received a nice letter from a secretary saying that she regretted that she was unable to send me the brochure I had requested because I did not include a SSAE. She said that they simply could not afford the postage to send brochures unless a SSAE was enclosed. BTW, I don't think I'm the one who did the dumb thing here. Anyone else have any similiar stories? Duane S3 #: 3569 S3/Hospitality Suite 29-Dec-91 17:40:07 Sb: #3555-#Something dumb? Fm: Mike Steiner 70363,2220 To: Duane Bristow 72711,1414 Someone in Mensa--I forget who, but I think that it was Dan Tobias--sent a paper to a university via first-class mail, and they returned it to him with a note via first-class mail saying that it had to be sent via certified or registered mail in order to make sure that it doesn't get lost in the mail enroute to the university. There is 1 Reply. #: 834022 S0/Outbox File 30-Dec-91 20:22:00 Sb: Something dumb? Fm: MENSA REP 3569 To: Mike Steiner 70363,2220 Mike, I have a computer client who is a physician. His wife, who works in his office, told me about the time she sent a billing form to Medicaid. She had signed the form for him. They returned it refusing to pay because they said the signature did not match the signature they had on file. This time the doctor himself signed and returned the form. Medicaid returned the form again, this time requesting that he initial his signature to indicate that he had indeed signed the form personally. Duane